Host Kirti Mutatkar concludes Season 1 of KBC (Kirti's Book Club) with David Shepherd to discuss Jostein Gaarder's "Sophie's World" - a philosophical novel that serves as an accessible introduction to Western philosophy. About the Book Sophie's World by Jostein Gaarder follows a teenage girl named Sophie who receives mysterious letters asking philosophical questions. As the story unfolds, Sophie discovers she's a character in a story being told by Hilde's father to teach his daughter about philosophy. The novel alternates between Sophie's narrative and comprehensive lessons covering major philosophers from ancient Greeks through modern times, exploring fundamental questions about existence, free will, and human consciousness. KBC Reading Radar Brain Fizz Factor: Both - Mental Fireworks (4/4) Bookshelf Worthy: David - Shelf Resident, worth rereading (4/4), Kirti - Shelf Resident (4.5/5) Season 1 of KBC concludes with this episode. Virtual roundtable discussions for all six books begin in July 2025.
Host Kirti Mutatkar concludes Season 1 of KBC (Kirti's Book Club) with David Shepherd to discuss Jostein Gaarder's "Sophie's World" - a philosophical novel that serves as an accessible introduction to Western philosophy.
About the Book
Sophie's World by Jostein Gaarder follows a teenage girl named Sophie who receives mysterious letters asking philosophical questions. As the story unfolds, Sophie discovers she's a character in a story being told by Hilde's father to teach his daughter about philosophy. The novel alternates between Sophie's narrative and comprehensive lessons covering major philosophers from ancient Greeks through modern times, exploring fundamental questions about existence, free will, and human consciousness.
KBC Reading Radar
Brain Fizz Factor: Both - Mental Fireworks (4/4)
Bookshelf Worthy: David - Shelf Resident, worth rereading (4/4), Kirti - Shelf Resident (4.5/5)
Season 1 of KBC concludes with this episode. Virtual roundtable discussions for all six books begin in July 2025.
Kirti Mutatkar: [00:00:00] So this is super exciting. So welcome to the show, Shep.
David Shepherd: Thank you.
Kirti Mutatkar: The reason I started this, so this is called KBC - Kirti's Book Club. And the reason, the whole concept behind this is I usually, I love reading books and I talk to people and people who, other people who read books, I get super excited about it. And I invite people, and I ask them what book they would like to read with me, and you suggest a book and I read the book. And when I'm done reading the book, we have this discussion and the step two of this, after we release the first season, which will be, you're part of the first season. After we release that, we also will have roundtable discussion once a month. Each book that we discuss will be released. So I'll, once we release this first season, I'll release the six episodes and the dates when we have the roundtable discussion. So I'm excited to have you today and you suggested the book Sophie's World. So why was [00:01:00] that?
David Shepherd: It had been on my list for a long, long time. I don't know how I discovered it, but I read a book by Joan Didion. I think it was like, I forget, I always get the name of the book wrong, which it's like the magical year of thinking, whatever. And it's about the year her husband passed away, or the year after her husband passed away. And somewhere in the book she had mentioned that like, he kept reading Sophie's World trying to figure out from like a literary perspective. Like how did it work? Like, just like how did, like the structure of the book, 'cause if you, when you think about it, it's like kind of a weird premise. Like the way that the author kind of does everything,
Kirti Mutatkar: So you wanna first give that, because if somebody hasn't read the book or doesn't know anything about the book, maybe we give them like a general idea of what the book is about?
David Shepherd: Yeah. So the book is centered around this girl named Sophie. And she keeps getting [00:02:00] all these letters in her mailbox that like, ask her really weird philosophical questions. And little by little, like the story develops where like she finds out who's sending them. And then there's like another twist where like there's this other little girl named Hilde and they have the same exact birthday. And little by little like Sophie discovers that she's a character in a story that Hilde's dad is telling her to teach her about philosophy. And when you're reading it, it's a little bit like, you have like this, you have like a chapter on like the story of Sophie, like how she reacts. And then you have another chapter that introduces a new person from history, a new philosopher. And it just goes back and forth between those two things. And then it gets like all sorts of complicated. So when I was reading the Joan Didion book, I was just like, the more I learned about Sophie's World, the more I was interested to be able to go. And you were a fantastic excuse [00:03:00] to motivate me to actually get it done.
Kirti Mutatkar: So what was
David Shepherd: And I loved it.
Kirti Mutatkar: The experience like? Did you read it in like a few settings or how, I mean, did it take you a long time? How did that happen?
David Shepherd: Yeah. I'd say it probably took me about a week or two. It was like, it was pretty quick. I was pretty enthralled. And I found like the philosophical chapters maybe more interesting than like, the story. Like, I didn't like particularly fall in love with Sophie, but there were like so many little things that the author did with Sophie that it made, it wasn't like the, that part of the book was boring in any way. Right. Like, just like the, like the dog Alberto Knox's dog is Hermes. Right. Which is hilarious. 'Cause like Hermes is like supposed to be the messenger in the Greek gods and everything. And he's like, you know, slobbering all over the packages that contain the manuscripts that are explaining the philosophers' points of view. And I just think that the author is [00:04:00] Jostein Gaarder, like what he, like writing the story was incredible, but just like the way he made all of the philosophers digestible was just fantastic. Like, I don't think you could ask for a better intro to philosophy than reading this book. And he handpicks, like he definitely cherry picks. Like he doesn't cover every philosopher who's important. He definitely cherry picks them, but like, just as like a once over fun way to learn about philosophy for someone who hasn't really ever studied it in any sort of like, holistic way from kinda like the ancient Greeks up until now, I thought it was about as good as it could possibly be done. I thought it was fantastic.
Kirti Mutatkar: That's so true because somebody has suggested this book to me. I was like, I wanted to read something about philosophy and they suggested this book. So it gives you a little bit and then you can go maybe deeper and get, pick up a book with Socrates, somebody else, right? And go deeper in it. But it gives enough idea. But what I [00:05:00] really liked, when you think of philosophy and people suggest few names, right? So, okay, read Plato. Read this. But this actually gives you the whole timeline. And as human thought as you, like, let's say the birth of the ideas come in, right? And like you, then you have science come in, there's God, the church, all that. How does that influence your philosophy and how it all flows? That was super interesting to me. That was really interesting.
David Shepherd: I think that was one of my favorite parts about the whole book was that Gaarder kind of, he does a good job of showing how the person who came before. The philosopher that he is talking about influenced that philosopher and how that philosopher was really responding to what came before. And at the same time was responding to like the ancient Greeks, which it seems like every philosopher kinda goes back to them in some way. And so like you get like the Renaissance and the Enlightenment and then like the revolution like all of the [00:06:00] things. And one of the things I didn't really realize was just like how, and maybe in hindsight, this is kind of silly, but how like the medieval period.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yes,
David Shepherd: Was just dominated by the church and that, that counts as like western philosophy and how big of an impact they had. That I didn't, I don't know. I didn't really realize like there's, they're really, like, if you think about like, like the true philosophers, if you take out the church, they were like mostly the ancient Greeks. And then you have to like transition, you have to get all the way to like 1500. Before you get like the next set, like you do have a couple guys in between, but like, I don't know. I thought that was super fascinating. He did a great job of like giving you the context.
Kirti Mutatkar: He did a really good job. Yeah, agreed. And for me, the idea was, and when you think Renaissance and all, all the things that you think about, I always think about it from an art standpoint. So when you're thinking the artist or Leonardo and all that, so for me, looking at it from a philosophical standpoint and connecting what we know from an [00:07:00] art standpoint, connecting from a history standpoint, and there was. As human beings, we do this all the time, right? We bring in our external ways of why we want certain philosophies to be out there. Today, look at the thought process. There's a thought process that we want to be out there. There's a political reason for that. There's a religious reason for that. That becomes history. And that was like, oh, like, so that was interesting how things change because the church comes in or the real, like a lot of things and you change, right? I mean, and how that, the rise of Rome and all that and how that now changes. It just really, I, yeah, he did an awesome job with that. That was my favorite part. The medieval part of the middle ages.
David Shepherd: Yeah. I mean, this book was so good that it inspired me to go out and get another book that's. Essentially the same thing. So Bertrand Russell's the History of Western Philosophy and I've only read maybe [00:08:00] like a hundred pages of it, but it is also really well written, but it just doesn't have any like Sophie's story. And it goes a little bit deeper into each of the things. And what I just like, one of the things that Russell says is that you get like a philosopher who makes a point and then you get the next philosopher who like disagrees. Then the third philosopher kind of like either combines the two before him or has like a totally different way of thinking about things, and then that cycle just repeats.
Kirti Mutatkar: Right.
David Shepherd: And you can totally see that in Sophie's World.
Kirti Mutatkar: But it's interesting even from that standpoint, first philosophy was about the universe and the world and all that outside. And as we get science, like as we progress later, it becomes us. Who am I? Who am I as an individual? What are the thought process and stuff? So anything that you, when you read this book, anything changed for you? The [00:09:00] way you think and the way you are? Who you are.
David Shepherd: I think it gave me way more confidence,
Kirti Mutatkar: Ah, really?
David Shepherd: The, I, the idea that. So I think what the opening question that Sophie gets is like, who are you? I think that's, I think she gets two of 'em, but that's one of them. And I think that's still a very worthy question to ask yourself. Like in terms of your own, like self-education, I'm not necessarily saying like that you need to contribute to like philosophical thought, but as you, like, you get to like Hume and Kant and, and all these guys that come later. They're all kind of just refining some of that. And so the reason I took more confidence away from this is just like, it's, it's an unanswerable question and I'm not really sure that the answer is all that important. I think [00:10:00] it's much more of like being in the question. And so I just was, I just felt like, I was really enthused by the whole thing. Like it made me more excited to learn more. I thought that like philosophy might have more to, to offer than just being like, you know, a college course that you cram for before the exam. Yeah. And I and I, and so one, one thing that's like, that was in the back of my mind the whole time reading this thing is like. I really like Ayn Rand's books, and I actually just reread The Fountainhead and she gets a ton of flack, like a ton of flack. And I'm not sure if it's like justified or not. I don't know that much about her and about like the real reasons why people get upset with her. But when I, like when I was reading The Fountainhead, like, it's so obvious that like she takes real. She [00:11:00] thinks one of the real problems in the world from her point of view is that people just react to their emotions, right? That they are, that they're not responding, they're reacting. And so as I was reading this book, like I have her in the back of my head and I'm trying to like tease out like what, like what really is the role of emotions? In our world. 'Cause like you and I both come from like the school of thought that like emotions are really important. And that they're like a huge data point that can be super insightful. And I think, and one way you can read Rand's stuff is that like she just kind of throws all that out the window. And I think like when you get like more into her, that's actually not her opinion. That's kind of like what I think people like critique. But she's super, like she really, she basically says the only philosopher that's worth talking about is Aristotle because like everything was based upon just like pure rationality.
Kirti Mutatkar: Rational. Yeah. [00:12:00]
David Shepherd: And so I just found like going through the whole book and like getting the whole history, it's like I think there's a bunch of room for every individual to kind of figure out for themselves. How your intellect versus how your body and your emotions play together. And like, what? Like what do you want your principles to be? Or, or how do you wanna think about those things? And I think in general, most people are just way too governed by their intellect and they don't really think about their emotions in a very healthy, skillful way. But I don't think the philosophers nailed it either.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah, they, yeah.
David Shepherd: Right.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yep, yep. And it was interesting, right? The fact that was interesting to me was. As he was telling the story and as things are happening in our lives, right? As one philosopher leads onto the other, the history and the political, like where they are in the history, [00:13:00] right? As I was reflecting when I was in India with my parents, I had a different thought process and I was thinking about philosophy in a very different way. I was thinking, okay, as we get old, what are all the...
David Shepherd: And that's where you were when you were reading it?
Kirti Mutatkar: When I started reading it, when I was flying to India. And then you are thinking from an intellect standpoint oh, I really enjoy philosophy. I'm gonna go deeper. I then I wanted to get another book on going deeper. So you're thinking from an intellect standpoint. And then last week I was connecting from an emotional standpoint on the things. Like one of the who is that? Who says I think and that therefore I am right. So I think therefore I am. So I was thinking I have emotions, therefore I am, or who am I Right? Sitting with that. So it was interesting on even as we go through our days and things happen to us as we go through our days, our ideas change. But I liked, you said it gave you confidence. It gave me. And I think anything [00:14:00] that you do, right, the things that we've done together, the other the last weekend and the things you read, and like you said, you read The Fountainhead, all that somewhere down there, it sits in our brain and we start looking at things in slightly different way. That's how I see it, and that's why I enjoy books. That's my thing.
David Shepherd: So you've lived in the east and the West.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah.
David Shepherd: How did the book, I don't know, challenge parts of those two cultures? Or did it? I don't know.
Kirti Mutatkar: It was interesting. So the first part, when you think of the Eastern, so this, when the Greek and the, that initial part has a lot of. Eastern philosophies in there, right? The gods and the things. And then church comes in and that changes. And then you have the old way of looking at it, the new way of looking at it, the AD, BC, all that. And then he does go back and talk about, even from a Buddhist standpoint, from an Eastern standpoint, from a Chinese standpoint. So it was [00:15:00] interesting to see. So what I felt when I read it from my Eastern kind of upbringing and now being here. I felt we went through the whole thought process and then came in exactly where everything comes in. Who am I? That's the whole Eastern thing is who am I? Right? And it's like, and then you start thinking, what, who am I emotions? Am I my thoughts? Am I who is this person? So I felt that's what the evolution happened in my brain too. With that it kind of a blend of eastern and western combined and together.
David Shepherd: Interestingly, Bertrand Russell, in the first a hundred pages of his book talks about how like the Hellenistic Greek way of looking at the world is actually way more similar to Eastern philosophy,
Kirti Mutatkar: Yes.
David Shepherd: But it's the Semitic, it's the, like, the Judeo-Christian way of viewing the world that influences the Hellenistic stuff and that's how you get birth, the Western philosophy stuff. Right. And it's the combination of [00:16:00] like that Hellenistic and Judeo-Christian way of thinking about the world coming together and 'cause they're, they're oftentimes like at odds with each other. So apparently in the Hellenistic viewpoint like that, like time has no beginning and end. It's cyclical, which is like a very Eastern tradition, but in Judeo Christian, it's like, no, there's a beginning. God created the earth and there is going to be an Armageddon. There will be an end. And so I find, I thought it was super fascinating to like just see how Bertrand Russell in the first hundred pages as he steps through the different philosophers, how each of them tackled that and how like Plato was different than Socrates and there's all like, and yeah, I.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah. Because even in this book, he does that, right? So he. When the initial part happens and you split. So he talks about the split that happens and you take a few pieces from here. You take few pieces from here, and then you're moving forward. So Eastern stays Eastern, and so it's the whole that also was very interesting to see [00:17:00] how that thought process worked, including from me as like the Sophie's point of view or Hilde's point of view of female perspective. So here comes. Who's talking about a lot of liberal thought, and after that it's all cut off and you come to the end where in fact he even, she even says she keeps looking for these people in the encyclopedia and she doesn't find any reference to some of these things because people have cut it off. So it actually reminded me of another book called The Dictionary of Lost Words by Pip Williams.
David Shepherd: I love that book. She's an Aussie. Did you know that?
Kirti Mutatkar: Oh, she's okay. I love,
David Shepherd: I challenge anyone to read that book and not cry.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah, that's one of my favorite books. It's.
David Shepherd: Really? Oh, I loved it too. I thought it was great.
Kirti Mutatkar: Oh, maybe that's our next book that you and I will discuss because it, it was the whole, the way it happened and how she puts those things under the, and I love the relationships, especially for you, like, it's [00:18:00] the daughter dad relationship and it's like really, really cute. I love that about that. So yeah, that's a great book. So it reminded me of that on how history kind of remembers from who's writing the history. Right.
David Shepherd: Yeah, exactly.
Kirti Mutatkar: Okay, so when you look at this, Shep, so what do you think, where does this book stand on your bookshelf? Is it a book that stays next to your bed? Is it a book that you read and you say, okay, I'm done. I'm gonna give it away, donate it to someone? Or is it on your bookshelf? It's there, maybe you'll pick it up some other time. Where does it reside after you're reading the book.
David Shepherd: That's a great question. I think the book will be in that zone of like, I'm incredibly grateful to have read it and is up for being reread. Like it's good enough to be reread for sure.
Kirti Mutatkar: Right.
David Shepherd: It'll be interesting though. I'm gonna finish Bertrand Russell's History of Western Philosophy. [00:19:00] And what is interesting about that book is you have a mathematician and philosopher writing about philosophers and, and like, he wrote it in like 1948. So it's like probably the best and most modern perspective, right? I wonder if, like, I would rather reread that one someday as opposed to this. And I, and the only, and my only thought there is just like, when a book is written in this like suspenseful way when you're getting letters and you, and you're trying to like figure out the story, but then you already know the story and how it ends, does that take something away? It's like, it's kind of like when I was a kid, you read those Goosebumps books, right? Like they're mysteries, but then you know the answer. Like, would you ever go back and read it again? I don't know. But I do think, I think one way, I think one reason I would definitely reread it is like, if I ever [00:20:00] decided I was gonna write a novel and I was gonna use like the letter format, I think you have to read this book multiple times because it, I, it is probably the best one I've ever seen.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah, agreed. And did you find a parallel between, so one of the things I was reflecting as Sophie is thinking about how the world is created, right? The free will versus my thought versus somebody kind of, we have, it's already set for us. Somebody out there is writing Kirti's book or David's book and Shep's book, right? So are we players in this big thing? We don't know. So part of that, which we, she's doubting the existential thing, the angst we have, and Sophie has that. Like, who are we? Are we, am I, am I in somebody's book? I don't know. So that was interesting how he did that too, right?
David Shepherd: I thought that was the best twist of the whole book was how like Hilde played a trick on her dad coming home, like, and yeah. So that opens up the question is like [00:21:00] this idea of fate versus free will, where do you come down on that? Because like that was kind of, I mean that kind of is the central, like maybe that question and like the who am I question or who are you question are the two core questions. And this goes back again to like that, like Hellenistic versus like. Judeo-Christian way of thinking. It's like they both have different answers to those two questions, and most of Western philosophy is just like the philosophers are just coming up with refined answers to those two. So what do you think? Are you, do you believe in fate? Do you believe in free will? And how does that maybe change the, who are you question.
Kirti Mutatkar: That's a good question. Do I believe in fate or I actually believe in. I am, I don't think I am super religious. I'm like, I believe I don't know if I, I believe, maybe there is a God, I don't know. I [00:22:00] don't wanna, I'm not an atheist, but I'm not like super religious and I am focused about. I do and how I improve and how I do this. So I feel, I think it's more, I would be more on the free will side, but I don't know. I don't know. But then sometimes I wonder, and I think about the dream thing, right? Are we, is this all a dream? Is this like we wake up?
David Shepherd: Or a simulation. Are we in a video game type?
Kirti Mutatkar: I know. We don't know. We don't know.
David Shepherd: Yeah I don't know if I have a, I certainly don't have like a holistic answer to this, where I feel like all the puzzle pieces perfectly fit together. Like, if someone was asking me questions, I'd be able to like, answer each one intelligently. I feel like there's probably some like huge gaps. I don't know. I have a hard time seeing the world as there's not something that's like bigger than us that we don't [00:23:00] understand yet. And you know, I don't know if that, I don't I don't personally. Where I sit today, I don't think there's like a god up in the sky looking down on us, like judging us. But I am really, really hesitant to say that there's not something bigger than us that like is impacting things around us all the time. Like I had a teacher who was really into like Native American stuff and he called it like the spirit that moves in and through all things and like then you hear like the way like Einstein referred to God as like this like organizing principle that we're still discovering what it is. I think I probably fit more into that bucket. I do think like there's this idea that like the world or like. The universe can like speak through us as well, which I think kind of ties into those two thoughts. Where I [00:24:00] get bent outta all shape and I'm not really sure how to answer questions, is like, how does that then turn into free will?
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah.
David Shepherd: And I have like a, I have like Sam Harris on like one shoulder where you're saying like, free will is non-existent, right? Like you can't predict the next thought that comes into your head. Like, that's a great piece of evidence that there's no such thing as free will that like we are, the next thing that pops out of our mouths or pops into our head is literally just the result of all of our preconditions, like all the things that have happened to us in the past. Okay. That's interesting. And like, and then like the, the connotations or like the permutations of that is that like, well, what are we really responsible for? And that's where I get into like a bunch of weird territory where I'm like. You do something bad, you should be responsible for that. And then that pushes me back to like this idea like there is free will. And so I thought it was fascinating to like go, as you read through Sophie's World, like they talk about free will and
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah.
David Shepherd: Gaarder's point of view on it is [00:25:00] literally the exact opposite of Sam Harris'. Right? Which is like, no, like that is a thing. And I remember my, my grandmother who, was Mormon. She would just always come back to over and over again, this like really kind thing about even if you weren't a Mormon and you didn't believe what she believed, she believed in free will and your own ability to choose. And that was like, just like a core belief of hers. She definitely, like, you know, believed a lot of the things that the Mormons believe in, in terms of like not drinking and no caffeine and all that stuff. But she didn't necessarily judge people harshly because like she thought like free will was like the most important thing. And like that was like part of your salvation, right? Was to learn how to like harness your free will.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah.
David Shepherd: I don't know if she would've described it that way, but that's how I remember feeling about what she said.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah. Yeah. [00:26:00] If you remember it that way. That's true.
David Shepherd: It's true for me, right? It's
Kirti Mutatkar: It's true for you. That's how it's, that's how it works. Yeah. So where, so going back to when, if you, somebody, so let's say for the roundtable, right? So the session, the part two to this, if somebody doesn't have, doesn't pick up the book and read it, but knows a little bit about philosophy and just wants to have a discussion around it, would you recommend them to. People join in and listen and just have a discussion around this.
David Shepherd: Yeah, absolutely. For the same reasons, like just the last thing we just talked about, this idea of like free will. I think like the talking about philosophy adds so much, right? It adds so much and like it allows you to, I [00:27:00] think that's why I liked the book so much was it was like having a conversation with someone who was really, really knowledgeable about philosophy and I took it as just like someone was having a conversation with me and then it allowed me to like ask myself all sorts of questions and, and learned something new. Which I think goes back to the thing I said, like where it gave me more confidence like no one really has this thing called life figured out.
Kirti Mutatkar: So this book of all the other books, I think is a book that people should just join in, even if they don't read it. It reminds me of, so I started something called the Sunday Soirée. So once a month. Just a random topic, you take it, who am I as a question know is the world, are we connected? Or whatever that looks like. Right. And we used to just sit around and haven't done that this year. Last year was, I did a few, quite a few. So it, this seems like a very soirée kind of a thing where people join in and becomes a virtual soirée where we have a discussion around this. That'll be awesome. So, the part two will be exciting and one of the things I really like about reading books, sometimes you read a book, you have a [00:28:00] certain way you're thinking about things, right? And you read a book and that changes that for you or gives you a new perspective or new lens to look through. So that, that and soirées were that reason why I had started that. Anything like that happened to you or, or when you, or if somebody were to pick up this book and read it. Where would you rate it? So if you, is, was, was it like a flat soda for you that would be like a one, or was it high fizz factor where it's like, oh yeah, this is like, where was that? Or in between.
David Shepherd: This was this was high fizz factor. There were like many times where I like literally put the book down to like, think about whatever I just learned.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah. Yeah.
David Shepherd: Yeah. Yeah. So for me, like high fizz factor I, I loved it.
Kirti Mutatkar: It was definitely for me too. Yeah. And even if it, basically, if you don't know anything about philosophy too, it's interesting because it gives you insights and just enough to kind of pique your interest and you can then [00:29:00] go deeper in any of the philosophers so
David Shepherd: And what I, one of the things that I liked about this book was like, I talked about it a lot. For weeks afterwards. And what I found to be super interesting was that there are a lot of people who know the book but haven't read it. There are a few people who have read it, and there's a whole bunch of people who have never even heard of it. And so like, that was a super fascinating scenario where I, I don't think that, like, I don't think I've come across very many books where you, where I was like, you had all three of those buckets. People had read it, people had heard of it, and people had no idea. And across all three people were excited to talk about it, which I thought was interesting.
Kirti Mutatkar: And quite a few people have told me, oh, it's on my reading list and it's on my reading list. I've never gotten to it. It's on my reading list. So hopefully people will start getting to reading and I, I wanna schedule it so we have, people get couple months to read it because it's a book that sometimes you wanna [00:30:00] read a few chapters and like sit in it. And I found that also fun to do. And then you go back and read that because I did audio and I was listening to it and reading it. So the audio part was in a different phase and my reading was different. So that was very interesting too. So to do that.
David Shepherd: Where does this, like you, you had a question before to me, like, where does this sit on, like your bookshelf, you know, are you, do you toss it in the bin or do you reread it? Do you recommend it? Like how do you feel about the book?
Kirti Mutatkar: I feel it'll not be next to me on my bed for sure, but it'll definitely be on my bookshelf. And I am actually not big fan of Kindle or anything like, I like physical books. So this book is gonna stay, right? It's gonna stay right next to my bookshelf and I. I'm pretty sure I'm gonna go back to it because I liked the fact that it gave a framework of where to start on which ones to go deeper. And then I might go, I'm actually really interested in Plato right now because maybe from a female standpoint, [00:31:00] I don't know. But I was really intrigued by his way of looking at things. So I might like, oh, let me go read more about this. Right? So this book gives me that. So that was that. Definitely on my bookshelf, definitely recommending it to people. I would, so if I'm rating it from one to five, I would say very close, 4.5, not right next to my bed, but very close.
David Shepherd: Yeah.
Kirti Mutatkar: So this has been awesome. This is really cool. And I'm excited to see people joining into the roundtable for this one especially because I think it'll be a great discussion and I think maybe we'll do a round two with another book for season two.
David Shepherd: Yeah. Yeah. I like it.
Kirti Mutatkar: This is good,
David Shepherd: Thank you so much for inviting me. Like I, I really relish like reading books in general, but even more so like the conversations. And I'm very happy 'cause I think I gave you three or four options and I'm very happy you picked this one. [00:32:00] Because like, I think it just, it lends itself to endless conversation.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah. And thank you for introducing this book to me because it just gave me a taste for philosophy that I can go deeper and look into it. And that was the whole idea behind this, right? And what you said. Reading books is fun. I like to read books, but when you discuss a book after you read it, it just gives you a very different perspective and or gives you like a, huh, I didn't think about this or this. It makes the book experience even more alive, and that's the whole concept behind this. So thank you for joining on season one of KBC. Thanks Shep.