Host Kirti Mutatkar continues KBC (Kirti's Book Club) with Peggy Plair to discuss Ann Patchett's "Tom Lake" - a novel about family, memory, and the stories we tell about our lives, set during the COVID-19 pandemic. About the Book Tom Lake by Ann Patchett follows a mother telling her three adult daughters stories about her past while they work together on their family cherry farm in Michigan during COVID-19 lockdown. Through flashbacks, the daughters discover their mother's previous life as a young actress, her first love with a charismatic but unsuitable actor, and how she met their father. The novel explores how our children perceive us versus who we really are. KBC Reading Radar Brain Fizz Factor: Peggy - Gentle Bubbles (3/4), Kirti - [not specified] Bookshelf Worthy. Both - Purchased after library rental, plan to revisit and recommend to others Both hosts recommend "Tom Lake" as a relatable, feel-good read that resonates with anyone who has navigated unexpected life changes. Patchett's masterful character development creates distinct personalities for each daughter while exploring universal themes of family relationships, finding peace in ordinary life, and understanding that every person we encounter shapes who we become. Next Episode: "The Midnight Library" by Matt Haig - continuing Season 1 of KBC
Host Kirti Mutatkar continues KBC (Kirti's Book Club) with Peggy Plair to discuss Ann Patchett's "Tom Lake" - a novel about family, memory, and the stories we tell about our lives, set during the COVID-19 pandemic.
About the Book
Tom Lake by Ann Patchett follows a mother telling her three adult daughters stories about her past while they work together on their family cherry farm in Michigan during COVID-19 lockdown. Through flashbacks, the daughters discover their mother's previous life as a young actress, her first love with a charismatic but unsuitable actor, and how she met their father. The novel explores how our children perceive us versus who we really are.
KBC Reading Radar
Brain Fizz Factor: Peggy - Gentle Bubbles (3/4), Kirti - [not specified]
Bookshelf Worthy. Both - Purchased after library rental, plan to revisit and recommend to others
Both hosts recommend "Tom Lake" as a relatable, feel-good read that resonates with anyone who has navigated unexpected life changes. Patchett's masterful character development creates distinct personalities for each daughter while exploring universal themes of family relationships, finding peace in ordinary life, and understanding that every person we encounter shapes who we become.
Next Episode: "The Midnight Library" by Matt Haig - continuing Season 1 of KBC
Kirti Mutatkar: [00:00:00] So this is Kirti Mutatkar and this is a new thing I'm starting, it's called KBC - Kirti's Book Club. And what this is, is I love reading books and usually when I talk to people I honestly get attracted to people who love books, right.
So, and we start this discussion and I ask people if they would wanna come on the podcast with me and have a discussion around a book. And once we release season one, what we wanna do is to have virtual book clubs or roundtables based on these books. The six books, the six part podcast episodes will be released and then we'll have dates when people can come back and do the roundtable.
So today I'm super excited because I have Peggy here and I did not know you read, Peggy, at first, but I think there was some book I mentioned and I saw that spark in your eyes and like, oh, you love books. And I love books. And we got super [00:01:00] excited about it. So excited to have you on the podcast.
Peggy Plair: Thank you for having me here.
Kirti Mutatkar: So one of the things I do is when I ask, my first question is, would you want to come as a guest on my podcast? And then my second question is, what book do you recommend? And you recommended Tom Lake. Why was that?
Peggy Plair: I found Tom Lake to have a lot of parallels in my own life, when I was raising my children, and how our children perceive us and what they think of us. And then understanding like where you really come from and how you got to where you are.
And Tom Lake was really good about showing how parents and children's relationships and how they perceive each other. So yeah, it was a really good book on how [00:02:00] that kind of changes across time, you know?
Kirti Mutatkar: That is so true. So I was gonna say something, but before we get to that point, do you think we should give like a synopsis of what this book is about? But I want to come back to this point because that's exactly what I thought too.
Peggy Plair: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think we should give a little synopsis.
Kirti Mutatkar: You know what, like, what is Peggy talking about? Let's give a quick, without giving away
Peggy Plair: Without giving too much away about the book itself, because it was a very easy read. When it begins, you see the main character in one light as a young girl and then you kind of, the author, the way that she built this storyline, she started in one place and then she moves forward to the future and then takes you back in time on [00:03:00] how the parent-child, you know, it really does send you back and forth in times. I think that's kind of might be challenging to some readers, but it really is about a young girl and how she starts out and how her life changes through circumstance.
You know, she has this love in the beginning that she thinks is a true love, and then finds out that it's not, you know, it's not really what she originally thought it was. And then sees somebody else or meets someone else who I think this person fell in love with her long before she fell in love with them. And then the life they ultimately have together. It just really makes you think about, but that's really what the story is about is how what we think in the beginning and where we start [00:04:00] out may not be where we end up.
Kirti Mutatkar: That's so true. And this was set during COVID times? Yes. And I think she also wrote it during COVID time. And this is, she's telling the story to her three daughters during COVID. And kind of reflecting back, so going back to your first point, when we look at our parents or our kids look at us. They have a very different image. Right? I mean, that's what the author brings out and as she's telling her story of what she had done before, it just changes.
I think even for herself when she's telling the story, she is also understanding her life better by through her own story, and the daughters understand her better, which was
Peggy Plair: Yeah. And the daughters, you know, the daughters were kind of surprised that she lived the life that she lived. I don't think we often share with our children [00:05:00] where we come from. You know, they see us one way. I know even when I was raising my own children and, you know, our daughters, my daughter, 'cause my daughter and I, at a certain age in her life, we were very, it was a challenge.
It was very combative and very, you know, mom didn't know anything and all of that. And you saw a lot of that in this story too. How, you know, one child perceives one thing and another child perceives something different. And you know, they're so rebellious. And then, then in a certain, another part of their life when they all have to come together because of COVID.
You know, COVID really changed us all. Right, right, right. It made us see things differently. Made us do things differently when they all come together and they're kind of huddled together and they're telling this story, and these children begin to realize that their mom comes from much different [00:06:00] stuff and so does their dad. Their dad comes from something different. So yeah.
Kirti Mutatkar: What they see today is somebody who's taking care of a cherry farm in Michigan. Right. And her story's quite different. Right. And why she did what she did and why she chose what she chose.
Very interesting choice and I, so one of the daughters reflects back because she is also into acting and she's kind of trying to see what that would be for her. And also the interesting part was, which we see in real life, right? I have two sons and two sons are exactly the opposite. They do have, I mean some few things common, but different personalities, different people. And I really liked how she built all the three daughters and all of them. You got to the depth of who they were, which was really something, it's very hard for authors to do that
Peggy Plair: Yeah. And when she built these characters. She did it in such a way that you [00:07:00] come to know each one of them, both their future plans, their passions in life, how they all are very, very different.
You know, one is the caregiver, their love of animals or their love of nurturing. And the other is, you know, not wanting to have anything to do with nurturing and. You know, you just see these different personalities in these young ladies. Which again, hearkens back to the mom of how she developed this strength in them.
Without even realizing she developed this strength in them. And the author did that very well. You know, Ann Patchett. How she built this story and how she interwove the COVID epidemic and pandemic that was happening at the time, and how these circumstances bring us [00:08:00] together. We learn so much more about each other when we're faced with these adversities. Right.
Kirti Mutatkar: Right. The other part I thought was really cool about her was she was not judgmental or she was not... Even with the actor that she's in love with. Right. You kind of see his good, not so good parts. But she has no regrets. She doesn't say anything bad. She's not judgmental. And it reminded me in life, right, you come across people and usually in books, when you read, people make a good character amazingly good and a bad character amazing. Like, it's like the extremes, right? They're like, everything about them is bad. And she had a nuanced approach and, you know, the life of the actor could have been very different. And her true love is the guy you actually wanna fall in love with, that kind of guy. Right? So they have those distinct characteristics, but she still has this nuanced thing about them, which was, which I felt was really good because that's [00:09:00] what makes us human. We are not all good and all bad.
Peggy Plair: Yeah, yeah. I agree. It wasn't like he was bad. It was just like, you know, you think you're compatible with somebody and then you're so in the midst of that newness of a relationship. And then suddenly you're faced with, oh wait, that may not be exactly what I thought it was.
And then you're having to face a different reality of, I think she, you know, to a certain extent, she was always gonna have some love for him. Okay.
Kirti Mutatkar: Right. She does. You can see
Peggy Plair: Yeah. Yeah. And I think she, again, the author weaving that in the tale of, you know, and a love doesn't end [00:10:00] just because you don't have the same belief system or you go on a different path. There's still gonna be some caring and some love there, but it's not gonna look the same.
Kirti Mutatkar: That's actually a really good point. Yeah, that's a good point. What is
Peggy Plair: What is it and how do you, you know, there's that whole beginning of a relationship, right? Where there's the newness of it and the passion and the whole, you know. Stuff, and I think, you know, when you realize that you're never gonna be able to give to that person, what they really desire is when you realize, well, wait a minute, that it has to change the love or the beginning passion.
All of that stuff, it changes across time. And the person that you go the distance with is the person who has more of your [00:11:00] qualities and skills and appreciation. That's the person that has the test of time. I think these two individuals in her life that came along really showed her that, you know how, yeah, she could love them both, but one was the test of time and the other was always gonna, he kind of like.
Without that relationship, I don't think she would've ever been who she was in the end. Right?
Kirti Mutatkar: That's correct. Isn't that true with all of us. Right. Every day we are a different person because of people who we interact with and what that makes us, that changes us in a little way, right? Every small subtle ways we change, we think we, so she, and even from a work setting or any other setting, you think when you get success or whatever you. Look back and there's certain things that have happened in your life when they were happening were not so cool, but if they wouldn't have happened, you wouldn't have had the success that you had today, right?
Yes. I feel that at where I am at with UnitedAg. I feel that because if we did not have couple years of somebody coming in [00:12:00] and I shouldn't say not knowing what to do, but that really helped me make me successful. So that happens in all our lives. Right? She had to go through that. She wouldn't have been happy where she was today if she wouldn't have done that.
Peggy Plair: Yeah. And then, you know, I was kind of having this conversation earlier with some individuals about how, you know, every person we encounter has an influence, right? They impact us in a certain way. Every path that we take leads us to a place, and sometimes we don't always know where that's gonna go, but at the end of the day, you know, it's, if it had not been for this, I would've never had that.
Right? There's always a reason and there's a reason for that path. You make choices in life. And sometimes those choices [00:13:00] don't turn out to be all that great, but they still have an impact on you. Right? They form who you are. And without those, you wouldn't be who you are. You'd be somebody different.
So, and this is the one thing about, you know, when we started talking about books, you and I, and we found that we shared that love, that passion and the fact that these stories can take us to a place that we may never get to in our life, but they can still bring us a knowledge, a place, a feeling, an emotion.
They evoke all these things when you're reading this written word that somebody had the talent. 'Cause I, you know, it's such a talent to be able to write a story where it is impactful to that reader. I don't know how people can say, I don't like to read. I just know I can never,
Kirti Mutatkar: You know, the other interesting part is people say, sometimes say, I need [00:14:00] only nonfiction. I don't read fiction. And I actually feel, sometimes feel sorry for people like that. I know I might have some listeners who are like, what are you saying? But the reason behind that is, I truly feel through fiction. It's not like when nonfiction is teaching you something. Most of the time fiction is also teaching you something, but it's teaching you something through a story, right?
It's just you need to look back, like don't take it at face. Look at Anne Patchett's things that came out of this. The relationship between a mom and daughters of not having regrets and not thinking your path was right or wrong, right? Any path you take in your life leads you somewhere, and that's what it, this is all about.
It's not, oh, if I would've gone with this one, this is the right one, and that's the wrong one. I took the, no, this is life. This is what we all as ordinary human beings do and live. Right. So there's so much to learn from fiction. Yes. And [00:15:00] so sometimes when I hear that, I'm like, deep down it bothers me a little bit because fiction is also, you change, it changes you in a little way.
Peggy Plair: Right? But fiction is not, fiction always has an element of truth. In fact, it comes from some place, right? Either that author experienced the emotion. Even when you read, there's so many different genres of books, you know, from business books that's teaching you professional tasks or how to deal with people or how to build a relationship or, you know, from a biography, an autobiography where people are talking about other people's lives, that all comes from a place and authors, there is always an element of truth to [00:16:00] them. You know, somebody, just like this cherry farm, right? You and I are working for UnitedAg, which is the agricultural industry. We know people that are farmers that have workers who are out there, which they also have elements in this book of how these migratory workers come in and they're working and they're picking the cherries and they're different seasons and, you know, all this information comes from an element of truth and you see that and it's just a different perspective of sharing a story in a different way. So I don't think fiction is a hundred percent fiction. I do think it carries an element of truth to it
Kirti Mutatkar: A hundred percent even I was, I was just actually reading, I don't know if you've read Mad Honey by Jodi Picoult. It's my next book. Yeah, it's like a really popular book, so very hard to get. I haven't, I actually read half of it and I [00:17:00] lost it on Libby so I have to, I still don't know what the ending is, but in that the main character takes care of bees. And I learned so much about bees by just, so the same thing in here. She's talking about a cherry farm and the workings of a cherry farm.
What happens in a cherry farm? And you're transported to that cherry farm and you connect with what's happening. So a hundred percent I totally agree with that. Yeah.
Peggy Plair: Yeah. And even when they're talking about, you know, having to burn right, to cultivate the field and how the child's mind is like, well, are you gonna. Are you gonna get rid of me that way if I'm not cultivating anything or I'm not growing in how this child's perspective of what they have to do to survive or to make that farm fruitful in how they perceive it. These are all things
Kirti Mutatkar: You know, I missed that, what was, so that this was one of the daughters feels [00:18:00] that that's what needs to be done. Ah,
Peggy Plair: One of the daughters kind of like,
Kirti Mutatkar: She's thinking, oh, my parents have to do
Peggy Plair: To do this.
Kirti Mutatkar: So are they gonna do that
Peggy Plair: When are they gonna get rid of me? Yeah. Like, when are they gonna, yeah. So she's. It's almost traumatic for her that this event has to take place on the farm. And then when she realizes this is the way of the, this is the way of the farm life, this is what we have to do to make sure that our crop is gonna be cultivated. All of these things come with an element of truth. These are things that have to happen. Otherwise, the authenticity of the book. You know, it, fiction is fiction to a certain extent, right?
Even when you talk about, you read other genres such as, you know, a fantasy genre or, you know, Game of Thrones or any of those, if you really think about some of these things, they're built on war and they're built on [00:19:00] things that actually took place. They just take 'em and use them differently and put some imagination into them, and.
Kirti Mutatkar: That's true. The Game of Thrones is all about
Peggy Plair: It really is.
Kirti Mutatkar: You can apply that strategy to business. Yes, you can apply that strategy to relationships. There's so much of that. There's so much learning that happens in that, that that is so true. One of the things that you said reminded me of something. You know, when you, when we are as parents, you are a parent. I'm a parent and you have employees reporting up to me. You and I have that same, right? So what I feel, which has recently I've been thinking about this, sometimes we say or do things and our intention is very different than what the young child hears or the employee hears.
Right? And they for them, it builds their whole narrative around that. And the parent might be [00:20:00] doing it, maybe sometimes it's just an offhand comment or maybe unintentionally said something and the child remembers that. Like reminded me when you said you're burning all these trees to get new. This child is thinking, oh, my parents do that, so they're gonna do this to me. So there's so many things in our lives that we do. That when you reflect back and you think, oh my God, this young child, especially when it's a 12-year-old, a 10-year-old, like, oh, this is not so, and they start building, they start thinking that parents have conditional love.
If I do this, they will love me.
Peggy Plair: Yes.
Kirti Mutatkar: And that is such a bad way of looking at it. And the parent has no idea this is happening to the kid. Which is something I've been thinking a lot about
Peggy Plair: Yeah. I mean, you don't know. You never know what somebody else is thinking, right? You never really can get into somebody's mind. But when you think about children and how they're developing, and I think there's a lot of [00:21:00] that in this book too, about how as the children we're developing. The things that we did, the things that we said, how they perceive things, you know, and then when children go through that rebellious stage and they're thinking, you know, oh my, you know, my parents don't know anything. And, and you're trying to help them understand you don't understand that I've lived that I, I get it. But they never think that you've lived a life. They think that you were like, you know, suddenly their parent. Yeah. And, really they don't understand that you come, you know, you lived a life before they even were even thought of or had them.
And that's true. I think that's what a lot of this story is kind of like. Brings to light is that children don't know that you had a life before them or that it even existed.
Kirti Mutatkar: Right. They see you as a mom and dad. Right. That's what happened before. It's very different to them. So, Peggy, one of the [00:22:00] things I do as part of the podcast is to rate the book. And my rating is, is it a flat soda or is it something that sparks bubbles, right?
Champagne. So where does for you, because the way I would look at a book, when you read a book and ideas start happening in your head, right? It triggers something and you're like, really super excited. So where does it land for you? This book, where was it like a. Made it, like a sparkling, like effervescent or was it a flat soda or anywhere in between?
Peggy Plair: It wasn't a flat soda. I found it very entertaining. You know, it made me reflect on, you know. How did my children perceive me? What did I, how did I influence them? Did I give them a foundation to make them successful? So it sparked [00:23:00] thought, and it, but it was, it
Kirti Mutatkar: Bubbles,
Peggy Plair: Yeah, gentle bubbles. I mean, it was gentle bubbles and it gave me thought provoking, I would probably read it again, just to focus on how the story was built. But I did have a lot of really good takeaways. A lot of really good self-reflection. So yeah, I mean, it wasn't a high bubble, you know, thing, but it wasn't a flat soda either. It was, you know, if I were to do like a zero to 10, it was probably eight. It's up there, you know.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah. What about if you, bookshelf worthy is what I call it. So sometimes you read a book and you say, okay, I'm done with this book. I'm gonna donate it. And done. Sometimes you have a book [00:24:00] that you keep on your bedside and you wanna revisit it over and over again. Sometimes you find a book that you wanna say, Hey Peggy, this is an amazing book and I'm gonna give it to you and I'm gonna treasure it. So where does that lie for you? What did you do with this book when you read it?
Peggy Plair: Well, originally when I first got it, I actually rented it from the library. And then it's, it was like, you know, I think I'm gonna purchase this to have as a to go back to. Yeah. You know, could I rent it again? Yes. But you know, if I make a recommendation, like there's oftentimes I'll recommend a book and sometimes the person won't, you know, go rent it or whatever. But if I have it, it's like, well, here, borrow it. You know, take it from me or, or I gift it to them. But rather than it languishing on a shelf or something like that.
So I did, I did buy this after I [00:25:00] rented it from the library and read it. Because I thought it was just a really nice read for one. And I probably will revisit it at some point.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah. Yep. I did too. So I own the book and have it, and there were, there are a couple things in the book that I don't want to give away, but what I always like in a book, when you think it's going in a certain direction and you come across, what, what happened here? Okay, what happened here? So there are a couple times that happens, which is exciting.
So, you know, we don't wanna say, we don't
Peggy Plair: Agreed. Yeah. We don't wanna give that away, but agreed. It was an exciting little, you're thinking it's gonna go one way, and then suddenly she surprised you. Yeah. And, but it was a happy surprise, right?
It was like, you're rooting for this, but then suddenly it changes and you have a little thing of disappointment. Like what? But then you realize, wow, that was. That was a good choice. So, yeah.
Kirti Mutatkar: And then sometimes, where do you find peace was another thing of how she finds peace in this and how some things in the past come back and [00:26:00] they feel this is peaceful to be on a cherry orchard.
So it was interesting. Some of the connections like that were very interesting.
Peggy Plair: Yeah. Again, you know, when we're thinking we're gonna be one place in our life and then we end up somewhere else, doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad thing.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yep, agreed. So what would you say to the listeners, why should they, why should they pick up the book and listen to this and then join us on the roundtable in a few months?
Peggy Plair: I think that this book probably everybody can relate to, to one extent or another. We all start out in life thinking we're going to, or most of us, I mean, you know, some of us flounder for a while, but eventually we find our footing and we say, well, this is what I want my life to look like, or here's where I want my career to go, or here's what I wanna achieve. [00:27:00] And then life happens and it takes you in a different direction. And to be okay with that, to be happy where you are. I think this book kind of like helps you see that it's, so especially if you want a feel good book.
Kirti Mutatkar: And sometimes you don't have to be like, doing super great things or whatever, just living our lives, the way we live our lives, there's beauty in it.
Peggy Plair: Yes, yes. It's the little things, right? Yeah. The little things that matter. Yeah. You know, somebody coming along and giving you a little gift you never thought that you would receive, and how that becomes a treasure for you, or, yeah.
Kirti Mutatkar: I think I might go back to the book later in a few years when you kind of forget what COVID was. This is a reminder of COVID days when we all reflected back that way and we said, we are okay with life being [00:28:00] normal. And then you go back and then you feel like, I need this and I need that, and you get all the materialistic things that you want in life at that point. We all, all of us, 99% of us said, this is a life I want. It's pretty peaceful. It's like, I enjoy this. And so when you forget that, maybe you go back and read this book and say, this is what we all said we wanted to be.
Peggy Plair: Yes. Yes. Because you think about it, you know, the year of COVID or the few years of COVID when everything just, you know, changed and what we thought and what was most important and you know, living through a snowstorm and you know, that kind of thing, and you're realizing, oh my gosh, that's all that other stuff's not important. What's important is these little things that, you know, at the end of the day that they're what matters.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah. So thank you so much, Peggy. This was fun. And I think you'll be back on season two looks like because we'll
Peggy Plair: There's probably another book
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah, there's so many books. I actually just read The Frozen River and I really like that, that [00:29:00] you might like it too. It's again, very popular right now, so on hold. But James, I was telling you earlier, before we got on the call, James is another one. And loved, love, love that book. So one of these days we'll have a discussion again, one of these books. So thank you so much for coming and I hope everybody listens to this and then to join us for our virtual book club,
Peggy Plair: That would be great. Discuss with people. Yeah.
Kirti Mutatkar: Yeah. Thank you.
Peggy Plair: Thank you for having me.
Kirti Mutatkar: Thanks.